Live steam locomotive must haves?

Chris Cairns · Post by **Chris Cairns** » Sun Dec 28, 2014 11:03 am

Hi Joe,

They should be nothing to be concerned about at this stage, but worthy of note.

Wheels - These are a known weakness of the original Mamod SL design, and equally apply to the later MSS ones, so it surprises me that some do not change them with all the other modifications applied. The axles are steel with shouldered ends. The wheels are Mazak (zinc diecast) and are punched/pressed onto the axle ends. Over time they can work loose (same applies to the coupling pins on the wheels) which then affects the quartering (timing).

Many will fit the after market replacement steel wheels from Dream Steam & RWM Steam.

Cylinders - Had a closer look at the eBay photos again. The right cylinder is an earlier MSS one where the cylinder end cap that the piston rod runs through has an additional face (thicker) to reduce the wear effect caused by the lateral/vertical motion of the piston rod. Difficult to be exact (due to the cylinder cover) but the left cylinder appears to be the current style of MSS cylinders. That end cap is flat (as they were on the Mamod SL ones) and there would be an identical cap on the other end with the hole blanked off with a blind copper rivet. There have been reports of those rivets fouling the piston inside the cylinder which will affect the running.

One thing from those eBay photos is there does not appear to be any method of determining the water level - no sight glass or water level check plug. I have a boiler on one of my Mamod inspired locomotives which also has this problem but as it is the same size as a standard Mamod boiler I fill it up to 75 mls. As your boiler is slightly longer & has a centre flue it will probably have a different operating level which you will need to determine. Be worth asking the eBay seller how much water he/she put in the boiler whilst testing it.

Chris Cairns

Joe · Post by **Joe** » Sun Dec 28, 2014 11:13 am

OK thanks Chris I will bare this in mind, itmshouldnt cost to much in worse case if it needs a new cyliner and wheels, I'm not sure with this boiler if I would be able to add a water gauge and pressure gauge to it as the boilers not a standard one, if I can then I will add them. I know you can get pressure gauges from dream steam but I'm not sure about water gauges
Cheers
Joe

steampig · Post by **steampig** » Sun Dec 28, 2014 2:21 pm

Chris Cairns:106815 wrote: ... I've standardised on using Roundhouse 220 steam oil for use in my Mamod/MSS fleet ...

My first SL1 came (second hand) with what looked like the original bottle of steam oil 1/2 full (or possibly 1/2 empty). It was much more like 220 than 460.

Joe · Post by **Joe** » Fri Jan 02, 2015 5:57 pm

Hi i found this in the shed and wondered if i could fill my loco with this?
I understand there's some debate about weather it will damage brass boilers but as mine is copper i thought it might be ok?

cheers
Joe

funandtrains · Post by **funandtrains** » Fri Jan 02, 2015 6:24 pm

That will be fine.

Joe · Post by **Joe** » Fri Jan 02, 2015 6:39 pm

just checking, will de ionized water effect a copper boiler?, i understand its best to empty the boiler after use but i will do that anyway

funandtrains · Post by **funandtrains** » Fri Jan 02, 2015 8:36 pm

There will be no significant effect on the copper boiler. It is only worth draining if you have long breaks between runs as the last bit of water is very hard to get out.

Joe · Post by **Joe** » Fri Jan 02, 2015 9:05 pm

Ok thanks

Chris Cairns · Post by **Chris Cairns** » Sat Jan 03, 2015 9:21 am

Not according to this report which says avoid deionised water - http://www.nmia.com/~vrbass/steam/stmintro.htm#DIwater

Chris Cairns

funandtrains · Post by **funandtrains** » Sat Jan 03, 2015 1:42 pm

Chris Cairns:107117 wrote:Not according to this report which says avoid deionised water - http://www.nmia.com/~vrbass/steam/stmintro.htm#DIwater

Chris Cairns

This article has been reffered to in other posts and has mostly been prooved to be rubbish. There is no perfect water as the purer the water the more corrosive it is, the important thing with small live steam boiler is to ensure that the water has as low amount of disolved chemicals as possible. Distilled water should have zero salts but is more corrosive. In any case deionised water is better than rainwater and will be fine unless you run the same engine several times a days over several years and it which case the engine will be more out before it is a problem.

This same thing comes up over again and again on all the forums and seems to get people worked-up over nothing, just don't use tap water if you get limescale or other deposits in your kettle. However if you have a brass boiler slightly limey water is recommended to protect the zince.

steam4ian · Post by **steam4ian** » Mon Jan 05, 2015 9:07 am

If you are concerned about distilled and de-ionised water just add a small amount of washing soda or Sodium bicarbonate to it. This will buffer the solution and make it less aggressive to zinc and solders. You will only need a pinch. adding a bit of tap water can do the same thing if it has not been softened.

Avoid softened water it has a comparatively high concentration of chloride ions which also attacks brass.

De-ionised water is the lowest cost approach after rain water. Dehumidifier water can have all kinds of nasties out of the air.

Joe · Post by **Joe** » Sun Feb 22, 2015 2:43 pm

I saw this on ebay http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/500ml-Dehumid ... 4877ef18a2 which seems a reasonable price, would this make the water i need for a copper and brass boiler?
cheers
Joe

steam4ian · Post by **steam4ian** » Sun Feb 22, 2015 9:54 pm

If you want to run your boiler on condensed sweat, fart and dog breath go ahead.

Would you drink the condensate from the dehumidifier?

bazzer42 · Post by **bazzer42** » Mon Feb 23, 2015 8:10 am

In answer to your question Joe, yes it would. I was always advised don't use tap water but from a dehumidifier it is ideal.
No, I probably wouldn't choose the output from it as a mixer for whisky but conversely I am happy to drink tap water but wouldn't use it in a steamer.
I used to scrounge water from a neighbour but following a water leak we have invested in a larger portable model and now have a supply "on tap".
Use as fresh as possible as after a couple of months you may get algae. Not clever enough to know what this would do to the inside of a boiler but not good, I would imagine.

Happy steaming, I need to get more steaming in but this weather doesn't inspire!

funandtrains · Post by **funandtrains** » Mon Feb 23, 2015 1:13 pm

Can I add a "sense of humour" to the live steam must haves, that and asbestos fingers!

Joe · Post by **Joe** » Mon Feb 23, 2015 4:00 pm

thanks, i will order one then

Keith S · Post by **Keith S** » Tue Feb 24, 2015 5:17 pm

What, a sense of humour?

Joe · Post by **Joe** » Tue Feb 24, 2015 5:24 pm

steam4ian · Post by **steam4ian** » Tue Feb 24, 2015 10:06 pm

De-ionised water costs about UKP 1.0 per litre so for the price of the dehumidifier you should be able to get 30 litres of de-ionised water.

How long will it take you to use 30L of water?

For only UKP you can purchase an RO unit that will provide laboratory quality pure water, no condensed fart or aerosol residues.

However you get your water don't forget to buffer it with some washing soda or Bicarb.

On the big engines the water can be quite high in dissolved minerals provided it is given the right treatment (additives) and they work best with a pH about 10-11.

Ian

ikcdab · Post by **ikcdab** » Wed Feb 25, 2015 9:48 pm

We don't have a mains water supply but we have a bore hole in the garden. The water that is pumped up is filtered, then it goes through a softener and is pumped to the kitchen where it is filtered again.
This is pure spring water with no addatives.
Safe to use?

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