The fight to save the DVLR

90733 · Post by **90733** » Thu Feb 10, 2011 8:17 pm

No.1- surley someone can't make you change your garden becuase of what they want to do, it's your garden, you own it!
No2- People in high places, thats just wrong.
No.3- If they do it, don't get mad, get even

spooner · Post by **spooner** » Thu Feb 10, 2011 8:28 pm

I through you could not build a extension within foot of the bounder?

Tobias · Post by **Tobias** » Thu Feb 10, 2011 8:31 pm

Would it help if we all wrote to them to say "You're a Bad Man, Jeremiah Jobling" (or similar)?

right time for spam mail where's the address?

Narrow Minded · Post by **Narrow Minded** » Thu Feb 10, 2011 8:47 pm

I'd still say that they should make good any damage to your property.
Reinstating the raised flower bed with its own retaining wall and suitable air gap would be the simplest solution and a small job for someone in the trade.

It's surely not possible that they'd be allowed to force you to alter your property!?

hussra · Post by **hussra** » Thu Feb 10, 2011 10:55 pm

Narrow Minded:48135 wrote:It's surely not possible that they'd be allowed to force you to alter your property!?

I was thinking about this again, and I suppose one question is whether permission was required and the Party Wall Act was complied with when the raised bed was originally built (which may well have been by a previous owner.) Rather less critical when it's just a garden wall.

One possible place to look to for advice would be http://www.gardenlaw.co.uk/ and its accompanying forum.

Thinking about the possible listed building status, I had a similar enquiry a couple of years ago about the parish church where I am churchwarden - wanting to know how far the "listing" extended. The advice from our local council at that time was that:

Any object or structure fixed to the building, or, any object or structure within the curtilage of the building which, although not fixed to building, forms part of the land and has done so since before 1st July 1948 is treated as part of the listed building.

Obviously that doesn't define "curtilage", and that is likely the sticking point? But surely a party wall doesn't belong to one side or the other but to both, by definition, and therefore blooming well ought to form part of the curtilage?

(Edit, Monday morning:) Or, is the wall fixed to the building? My understanding was that this is some sort of courtyard arrangement? If it's attached to your house, and the house is listed, then my understanding is that the wall is listed too simply because it's attached to the house. There's no way for a single structure to be part listed, part unlisted.

Assuming your house is on the statutory list rather than a local one (there is no statutory protection for structures on the local list), what does the actual listing of your house say? You can find this through an advanced search on http://www.heritagegateway.org.uk/gatew ... earch.aspx (Our church's entry is at http://www.heritagegateway.org.uk/Gatew ... sourceID=5). If your listing specifically mentioned the wall in question then that could be highly significant.

Sorry to have gone on a bit. Lots of different aspects to this problem, all of which are worth pursuing...

mhlr · Post by **mhlr** » Fri Feb 11, 2011 12:00 am

Tell them there is a very rare species in that bed, and you are preserving it. That seems to stop anything... They can't dredge Falmouth harbour to allow big cruise liners in (therefore bringing in trade to boost the economy), because there is a rare sea snail thing living somewhere down there...

Or you're railway is "listed".

DVT Dweller · Post by **DVT Dweller** » Fri Feb 11, 2011 10:24 am

mhlr:48161 wrote:Tell them there is a very rare species in that bed, and you are preserving it. That seems to stop anything... They can't dredge Falmouth harbour to allow big cruise liners in (therefore bringing in trade to boost the economy), because there is a rare sea snail thing living somewhere down there... :roll: Or you're railway is "listed".

What you need is a bat nest!!!!! sit back and watch them panic. Ive seen that one done before.

laalratty · Post by **laalratty** » Fri Feb 11, 2011 8:36 pm

Ah yes, bat nests. That can stop almost anything! Bane of a few preserved railways as well

bessytractor · Post by **bessytractor** » Fri Feb 11, 2011 9:23 pm

mhlr:48161 wrote:Tell them there is a very rare species in that bed, and you are preserving it. That seems to stop anything... They can't dredge Falmouth harbour to allow big cruise liners in (therefore bringing in trade to boost the economy), because there is a rare sea snail thing living somewhere down there... :roll: Or you're railway is "listed".

they wanted to build a tower block of "upmarkey trendy flats" on the open space at the top of my road. Aside from being a completely inappropriate place to run construction lorries about (too many parked cars and narrow lanes/roads) the damned thing would have looked ghastly.

Then someone in the neighbourhood came to the rescue and pointed out that our little area is actually part of the nesting area of some rare bird.

That pretty much slammed the door in the developers face

cjallenby · Post by **cjallenby** » Sat Feb 12, 2011 4:56 pm

My understanding of house boundaries and fences is that, (though this maybe wrong...

) the boundaries belonging to a house are the left hand side (from the front) and the front one and the rear, unless it forms the left hand boundary of another house.

For example, the people at the back of my house owned the fence and took it down to replace it. This caused no end of problems on my railway as the line runs along side this fence which was covered in climbing plants which then trailed over the line and had to be cut back although not as serious as a wall.

Also a family friends next door neighbours wanted to build an extension similar to yours on demolishing an existing wall, but building regulators said they werent allowed to demolish it as it would disrupt the garden next door.

There is hope in your case, as surely the wall has to be built around existing structures so that you do not lose any garden space when it comes to things like damp causes. Whatever the out come however, the DVLR will continue im sure. Good luck with this and hope that things go better for you.

Dr. Bond of the DVLR · Post by **Dr. Bond of the DVLR** » Sat Feb 12, 2011 5:10 pm

Ahha! And things are, turns out the dodgy builders had totally omitted out wall from the plans presented to the council and planning office who didn't notice. Where our wall is on the plans is the new wall with no mention to the planning office of demolishing the listed wall (which we now know is ours). To keep all this quiet they released the public notices 2 weeks after the planning permission was granted. They have thus broken 2 planning laws and we have a strong case against them, what is more is that the builders have still not even bothered to notify us that they plan to demolish our wall!!!!!

It is certainly look better for the DVLR but I am still not holding my breath.
Thanks for all your support

Narrow Minded · Post by **Narrow Minded** » Sat Feb 12, 2011 5:50 pm

That's good news! Now make sure you maintain the advantage and keep them on the back foot!

DVT Dweller · Post by **DVT Dweller** » Sat Feb 12, 2011 5:52 pm

possession is 9/10ths of the law, keep at them now and im sure it will all have a happy ending.

hussra · Post by **hussra** » Sat Feb 12, 2011 8:29 pm

Pleased to hear things are sounding a bit more positive. It's good to have some clearer facts on ownership and listed building status of the wall, and also to have more info on the ways in which the builders have been naughty boys.

Keep us posted!

Dr. Bond of the DVLR · Post by **Dr. Bond of the DVLR** » Sun Feb 13, 2011 9:02 pm

lets have some piccies of this ruddy wall then shall we!
Weather vane and bird feeder really set off by the wobbly brick lines of the listed wall.

the development going on on the house behind us.

bessytractor · Post by **bessytractor** » Sun Feb 13, 2011 9:36 pm

whilst they're there you could ask the builders to re-render your wall

garrymartin · Post by **garrymartin** » Thu Feb 24, 2011 10:59 pm

laalratty:48214 wrote:Ah yes, bat nests. That can stop almost anything! Bane of a few preserved railways as well

Newts work well too. Seriously do not trust anyone from your local council, we have had some dubious decisions made regarding planning applications in our village. Stables in the form of bungalows, 400 foot tall wind turbines to name but 2. This despite no end of objections & expert opinions on behalf of the local residents.

pauly · Post by **pauly** » Thu Feb 24, 2011 11:52 pm

yes England is not a free country and us residents are mere pests to the higher ups.

yes sometimes they may take our opinions into consideration but the law of the land for them is usually "F**K YOU! We can do what we want and you cant stop us! HA HA"

a few streets from my home are the remains of an old manor and its grounds which include a wooded area and a beautiful lake, when the Lord died he willed the Manor and its grounds to the people of Middlesbrough but guess what local councils just decided that they now own it and have decided to sell it to developers!

MuzTrem · Post by **MuzTrem** » Fri Feb 25, 2011 11:55 am

pauly:48912 wrote:yes England is not a free country

Don't ever say that.

Sure, our democracy isn't perfect - perfect democracy isn't possible. But you only have to look at what's happening in Libya, or Zimbabwe, or Iran, to name just three examples, to realise how much better off we are.

Millions gave or risked their lives in the two World Wars for the freedoms we enjoy. We should be grateful for their sacrifice.

pauly · Post by **pauly** » Fri Feb 25, 2011 12:29 pm

MuzTrem:48935 wrote:
pauly:48912 wrote:yes England is not a free country
Don't ever say that.

Sure, our democracy isn't perfect - perfect democracy isn't possible. But you only have to look at what's happening in Libya, or Zimbabwe, or Iran, to name just three examples, to realise how much better off we are.

Millions gave or risked their lives in the two World Wars for the freedoms we enjoy. We should be grateful for their sacrifice.

sadly their incredible sacrifice that hasnt stopped our freedoms from slowly slipping away at a rate hard to notice.
I shall say no more on the subject.

I hope this bloody wall desispute is sorted out for you Zach and that your railway doent get wrecked.

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