VoR Wooden Bodied brake vans

[IrishPeter]

Does anyone happen to know if the original Vale of Rheidol brake vans had matchboard upper panels? I think they did, but the photos turned up by my google-fu were a bit vague. I am working on some stock for my line and I am rather taken with the original VoR coaching stock. However, I am doing a certain amount of adaption as the Coverdale Light needs a Brake-Composite for winter traffic.

Cheers,
Peter in AZ

[MDLR]

If it's any help at all, the IP Engineering model of it has matchboarding all the way up to "top of door" level - I can take a picture in the morning..........

[GTB]

Does anyone happen to know if the original Vale of Rheidol brake vans had matchboard upper panels?

Most published photos of the original vans aren't very clear, but they were matchboarded up to the letterboard (or whatever it's called in UK practice). Basically as far up as a line level with the top of the droplight in the guards door.

There are drawings in Boyd's 'Narrow Gauge Railways of Mid-Wales' and a fairly muddy photo. The IP model of the original version of the van on their website shows the arrangement. http://www.ipengineering.co.uk/page128.html

The original VoR passenger stock was built by MRCW, so there's no reason why they couldn't have built a bogie brake composite for another line........

Incidentally, VoR No.1 Rheidol, although a 2-4-0, isn't much longer than a Millie when scaled out and there are photos of it on a VoR train of two bogie carriages and a four wheel van.

Graeme

[IrishPeter]

I am not sure what the panels above the windows are called in British practice, but they are where to toplights go when such things are fitted!

I figured that either Met or Ashbury supplied the Coverdale Light Railway with its coaching stock. My vehicles will be longer than the NWNGR Summer coaches, but are about the same as the VoRLR MRCW vehicles. To save money everything was built to the same basic body shell with only the brake compo needing much in the way of special effort on the part of the builder.

As I tend to think things through, the story goes that as built there were three diagrams - an all-third; a composite; and a brake-third. Local tinkering resulted in a couple of variations - the brake-thirds became brake composites, and one of the composites became an all-third.

I will have to keep the body shells very 'clean' (free from glue and goofs) as the plan is to stain and varnish them to LNER livery. This will be a bit difficult for me as I am prone to free range woode glue when building stock. Matchboarding and the relatively simple body details should help, but I shall still have to be unusually clean.

I noticed that 'Millie' -although an 0-4-0T - is not much different in size to the two 0-6-0T 'flying bricks' designed by the NER but, like the Holderness Light they were intended for, never built.

Cheers,
Peter in AZ

[JMORG]

Darn you beat me to it!
I was thinking of creating a bogie comp. out of a VoR vintage brake and the 4 wheel VoR closed saloon!
We've made afew "Frankenwagons" using this method! Eg. a 6 comp bowsider made out of 3 old 2 compartment bowsided (pre laser-cut era) IP carriages, another bowsider comp from a 3 comp and a brake (both now sold on) and an Alfred County Railway style van (complete with roof look out) made from the Brandbright 4 wheel van and brake van.
As ever, show us some pictures!!
Cheers

[GTB]

I will have to keep the body shells very 'clean' (free from glue and goofs) as the plan is to stain and varnish them to LNER livery.  This will be a bit difficult for me as I am prone to free range woode glue when building stock.  Matchboarding and the relatively simple body details should help, but I shall still have to be unusually clean.

There's two ways to handle that for cabinet making, which should work for model carriages as well :-

- stain and/or varnish all the parts before assembly, that way a bit of glue in the wrong place isn't as obvious.

- use a fast setting PVA glue (I like the yellow ones like Titebond) and keep a wet rag or sponge handy to wipe any excess glue off the joints before it dries.

You pretty much need to use board by board construction for varnished wood rolling stock in this size I think. That, or build up an overlay made from pieces of suitable decorative veneer. Maybe you can get better ply where you are, but the stuff available around here has awful wavy grain that doesn't look right for this application.

Regards,
Graeme

[IrishPeter]

The plywood here is nothing to write home about either, and is probably the same stuff. There seems to be a plant in an obscure corner of Finland that keeps the world supplied. The U.S. supplier sticks a dirty great label on it which is an absolute PITA to remove and leaves glue residue.

On the other hand coffee stirrers are in plentiful supply, cheap to free, and with a little sanding look quite good, so I bet you can guess where the matchboarding will be coming from They are also long enough for the floorboards as Met was a bit prone to diagonally planking carriage floors, which is something that never looks right just scribed.

Cheers,
Peter in AZ.

[Spule 4]

The plywood here is nothing to write home about either, and is probably the same stuff.  There seems to be a plant in an obscure corner of Finland that keeps the world supplied.  The U.S. supplier sticks a dirty great label on it which is an absolute PITA to remove and leaves glue residue.  

Cheers,
Peter in AZ.

No kidding, I helped a friend with his layout, and grabbed some 2x4 studs at the local Home Depot.... Aus Österreich!!!!

And at my dad's local grocery was firewood, from Estoinia of all places...

I was at a dinner party talking to a guy about building "instant" boats with marine or smooth plywood. He has had no luck finding any anymore in the US, and he is in the hardware supply business!

[IrishPeter]

One interesting quirk one hits with modern timber versus Victorian timber when restoring 12" scale stuff is that a modern 2x4 is nowhere near the same size as a Victorian 2x4. The Victorian one is actually only a shade undersize whereas the modern version is more like 1.75" by 3.75." In previous existences that has led to no little frustration when patching up old buildings.

Peter in AZ

[Spule 4]

One interesting quirk one hits with modern timber versus Victorian timber when restoring 12" scale stuff is that a modern 2x4 is nowhere near the same size as a Victorian 2x4.  The Victorian one is actually only a shade undersize whereas the modern version is more like 1.75" by 3.75."  In previous existences that has led to no little frustration when patching up old buildings.

Peter in AZ

Nevermind Victorian, I have found it different even in 30-40 year applications!

[IrishPeter]

That does nothing to cheer me up as the house that we live in is 1961 vintage, so I guess that I will be shimming any bodges that I do in this house.

Anyway, the Brake-Compo is coming along quite quickly as the traffic manager is grumbling about having to use the Barsi type compo, which is a much bigger vehicle but offers only about the same number of seats.  The new compo is going to be a plywood shell with coffee stirrer matchboarding.  Hopefully it will end up clean enough to stain and varnish, if not it will get the 'teak brown' paint and varnish approach that the LNER used for parcels vans. stc.. I will need to give it a light sanding anyway to remove some marking out lines that inevitably remain on my models. That should also take care of any mistakes with the glue.

The coffee stirrer method of matchboarding is a lot easier than having to cut and sand all those annoying little boards that I had to produe the last time around, so I can see the race of matchboard carriages reproducing at a respectable rate.

Cheers,
Peter in AZ

[DVT Dweller]

Dont forget Peter if you are looking at pictures of the vans towards the end of their lives, certain areas had been re-skined with steel sheet. I havent got a copy of the VoR book at the moment (its on holiday at the PVLR along withe my steamline Rheidol). Though im sure it was just the bottom area's bellow the match boarding, the doors and the duckets. Im halfway through building an IP one based on the period just before the GWR rebuilt the bodies.

Steve